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Why EF?

Danny Simmons has a post on why to use Entity Framework.  Here's my main gripe with Danny's post and all other such posts on EF.  Microsoft keeps waxing on about how EF is so much more than an object relational mapper, but in reality it is still so much less than nHibernate, which has become the de facto standard for O/R M.  So how can it be more when it is less?  I understand that Microsoft has a grand vision, but Microsoft always has a grand vision and it only gets realized some of the time.  (Need I give countless examples?)  Additionally, there are often times when Microsoft's grand vision doesn't mesh with what the last 20 years of OOP has taught us!  Why do you think the nHibernate people (that includes me if you haven't guessed) scream so loud about POCOs (among other things)?  Because they know that the rest of the programming world has already learned this lesson and they are terrified that Microsoft is going to make a series of critical mistakes that lead the platform and its developers down a wretched path.  Sometimes Microsoft reminds me of people I knew in high school and college.  They are really smart, but when given complex assignments they wouldn't bother to read the project guidelines or pay attention to the teacher's instructions.  Thus, they failed, in spite of their grand ideas and brilliance.

Posted 05-18-2008 2:56 PM by Rob Eisenberg
Filed under: , ,



Steve Gentile wrote re: Why EF?
on 05-18-2008 3:36 PM
ok, can you provide some basis for these ideas you have? I'm curious where these comments are coming from? By the way, I am actively using NHibernate - I will use what is best to solve the customers problems. I haven't used the EF yet, but I also want to stay clear of any 'contempt prior to investigation' Are there certain elements of EF that you think have failed us? Again, just curious
Joe wrote re: Why EF?
on 05-18-2008 3:50 PM

Doesn't EF support plain old classes?  

Microsoft » Blog Archive » Why EF? wrote Microsoft &raquo; Blog Archive &raquo; Why EF?
on 05-18-2008 4:56 PM

Pingback from  Microsoft  &raquo; Blog Archive   &raquo; Why EF?

Peter Ritchie wrote re: Why EF?
on 05-18-2008 6:22 PM

Data-centric design pushed down our throats.  It's implementation first, user's second.

It's going to be a long and bumpy road, but people are coming around...

DotNetKicks.com wrote Why use EF
on 05-18-2008 6:23 PM

You've been kicked (a good thing) - Trackback from DotNetKicks.com

Rob Eisenberg wrote re: Why EF?
on 05-18-2008 6:54 PM


EF doesn't yet truly support POCOs.  (They say it will one day...but who knows when.) The funny thing is that LINQ to SQL does.  The only problem is that LINQ to SQL is missing many of the advanced features that I am happy to take advantage of in NHibernate.  Thus, neither EF or LINQ to SQL has what I need to get the job done.


I'm not writing EF off completely.  I agree with you that one should use the best tool for the job.  I guess I didn't portray my frustration clearly.  Essentially, it disturbs me when Microsoft markets a developer technology in terms of what they might be able to do with it in the next couple years rather than what it is right now.  Saying that EF is more than an O/RM is not true right now; it might be some day, but that still remains to be seen.  When it enables my job better than NHibernate, I'll switch to EF right away.  But that's not the case yet.  It just bothers me when Microsoft pretends like their future vision for a product is here now when it isn't and then tries to make devs buy in now.

Jak Charlton wrote re: Why EF?
on 05-19-2008 2:26 AM
"The future is yet to be written ..." Unless you work in marketing ... :)
The Inquisitive Coder » Blog Archive » Entity Framework stuff wrote The Inquisitive Coder &raquo; Blog Archive &raquo; Entity Framework stuff
on 05-19-2008 7:48 PM

Pingback from  The Inquisitive Coder  &raquo; Blog Archive   &raquo; Entity Framework stuff

Scott Bellware wrote re: Why EF?
on 05-20-2008 1:31 AM
"Why do you think the nHibernate people (that includes me if you haven't guessed) scream so loud about POCOs (among other things)?" Because we're cuckoo for poco puffs? :)
Hot Topics wrote Why Entity Framework?
on 05-20-2008 9:23 AM

Danny Simmons discusses the benefits of Entity Framework . Comments and analysis by In favor: Roger Jennings

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